Finding the Perfect Photog Part IV: The Real and the "Wannabes"

As of yesterday my first interviewees, the ones who enamored me with their video-photo package, have been fired before they were hired. That's right. FIRED! (a moment of silence for mourning)

My dilemma began Saturday night when I called my mother to hatch out the positives and negatives for each of my potentials. While my mother didn't really give me much advice in terms of what to do, she did listen ever so patiently and instead tried to pull out of me what I wanted in terms of pricing and packages.

I stumbled upon the conclusion that I REALLY wanted photographs of me prepping before the ceremony (and preferably FH too, but only if a second photog was included, which would cause the price of the package to go up, since it only included four hours. I also decided that I definitely wanted the engagement session as well, which would be and addition $300. I also concluded that if I was about to drop $2,000 on photos, they better be darn good, to put it nicely. Finally, I knew that our ceremony would be brief with not a whole lot going on afterward, so we could probably cut the videography by two hours.

Their package, originally $1600 would end up costing closer to $2,200, and literally breaking the bank. My mother suggested to that I request to see more photos, so that I could at least sleep at night regarding that, and also try negotiating the price. She also said I should check out their references to be absolutely sure.

I did not sleep well at all waiting for a response (I sent the e-mail about 12:30 am last night). Here is the contents of the e-mail:


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I have some questions:



1. I would really like preparation coverage before the ceremony (of the bride), along with some portrait shots before the ceremony. I am thinking this will add at least 2 more hours of coverage. Is it possible to lessen the videography to only cover two hours so that we can get the two additional hours of photo coverage? We are working with a budget at $2,000 tops for videography/photography, so it is not possible to have both (we would also love to have an engagement session which adds the $250 to the $1,600). We are also willing to spare the just having one copy of the video and the photo DVD if that helps.



2. I would really like to see a couple of your most recent complete contact sheets/proofs, particularly ones using natural lighting. If it is not possible to view a whole shoot on the web, I will be more than happy to meet this Monday morning.

Thanks in advance!

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It doesn't sound pushy does it? Doesn't it sound like a bride who is willing to drop two grand but would just like to know she will receive her money's worth? Doesn't it just sound like someone who hasn't drop two grand on anything in her entire life, especially for pics?

Here is the response:

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Hope you survived the big snow.

here are the answers to your questions.



1.  I understand your budget- however We do not split up the time with photos and video.  We are both booked for the same amount of time. so if you wanted 2 hours of getting ready- then it would be 6 hours for both.  however, i really dont think that 2 hours is necessary.  if you are getting ready near the site- then 45 min. of final touches, getting your dress on, and shoes (and 15 min. for us to drive to valley green)- is probably your best bet given your budget.  You can get really nice portraits outside at Valley green- which are way nicer than doing inside pictures where there is tons of other things that are often in the background. since your ceremony is at 9:30- you will need to be ready to put your dress on for photos by 8:00 am and remember it will take a couple of hours to do other getting ready things like hair and makeup- which really dont make that great of pictures.  
but we can give you a discount for engagement photos and do them for $200 instead of $250. and it doesnt save us money by giving only 1 copy of a DVD.

2.  as far as giving you "proofs" to see- i dont make proofs remember- i give everyone all 800-1000 fully edited high resolution, high image quality image on a DVD. I feel like there are tons of pictures using "natural lighting" -aka- "outside"  on the gallerey on the website, the blog, and the samples i did have with me when we met.  If you want you can go to my picassa site- (i emailed you a link) and that has some of the sample folders of pictures i send to couples while they are waiting for everything to be done. so that you know- i always think that outside pictures are the nicest and turn out the best.  it is the inside lighting that is more difficult. but you cant control all of the elements no matter what outside (there can be shade areas, sun spots). this is not a photo shoot that has all the lighting artificially done even for "natural lighting" photos. so i feel, with the picassa album, that this should be suffient.

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I know it is always hard to tell in writing a person's tone, but an already antsy-anxious-doubtful bride can easily be driven off the deep end. This e-mail developed numerous red flags for me.

Red Flag #1
You don't split services? Umm...okay. I did have an interview with them, explained how small our guest list was, explained we are not going to have a "typical" reception by any means, and that there wouldn't be a whole lot to photograph OR video tape after the ceremony, which would probably last all of 30 minutes or less. So either you suck as a photog and use your husband to back you up with video, or he needs endless video to make a decent DVD. On top of that, why would you try to upsell me to the $2,200 package when I clearly don't need six hours of video. Seriously?

Red Flag #2
"I understand your budget..." um, hello, if you "really" understood my budget you'd honor your "we are willing to work within any budget" slogan on your website and in your brochure, particularly in a bad economy. Also, it wasn't like I was offering less than what their original package was. I was trying to negotiate the higher price.

Red Flag #3
"since your ceremony is at 9:30- you will need to be ready to put your dress on for photos by 8:00 am and remember it will take a couple of hours to do other getting ready things like hair and makeup." No s&%# sherlock. I was very much insulted. DUH! Any major event in a lady's life will take MAJOR prep time. I hate when people assume you are naive because you are young AND meek.

Red Flag #4
"...getting ready things like hair and makeup- which really don't make that great of pictures." FYI, I have seen PLENTY of portfolios that include these shots, and I happen to love them. What, is she afraid of portrait shots or something?  And wait a minute––if I am willing to pay for these shots, why would you deter me?

Red Flag #5
"...we can give you a discount for engagement photos and do them for $200 instead of $250." WOW a whopping $50 off of $2,200. BRAVO!

Red Flag #6
"and it doesnt save us money by giving only 1 copy of a DVD." Mind you I only included this line in my original e-mail in an attempt to negotiate and express that I am will to sacrifice other things to get what I really want.

Red Flag #7
"as far as giving you "proofs" to see- i dont make proofs remember." Notice I also used the word "contact sheet." A real photographer would know that I am basically asked to see an entire reel of photos from specific couple to see how the photog's overall work is, not just their "best" shots that are selected with bias.

Red Flag #8
"I feel like there are tons of pictures using "natural lighting" -aka- "outside"  on the gallerey on the website, the blog, and the samples i did have with me when we met." Umm...yeah. Most of the her photos, even the new ones she sent to me used flash (I could clearly see it in the photos) OR equally as bad, were all over exposed (too bright, which is and EASY fix with photoshop that I can even do!).

And she does go on to say: "[these are] sample folders of pictures i send to couples while they are waiting for everything to be done," but my question is, why don't you have a similar feature like that on your website of edited pics? And why are your "edited" pictures still SO over exposed even in the sunlight?

So it either means:
A. she really doesn't know what natural lighting is
B. she is not a REAL photog
C. she doesn't know how to change the settings on her camera
D. she doesn't know how to make a two- seconds fix in Photoshop to adjust the over exposure
E. All of the above.

And what takes the cake about this line is that she really didn't show a whole lot of samples in person––it was mainly a photo book of her sister-in-law's wedding, which again, the lighting was horrible. Plus she mentioned doing 50 or so weddings. Fifty weddings, yet all of the photos I've seenare "sufficient" which she says at the end of the e-mail.

Red Flag #9
"If you want you can go to my picassa site- (i emailed you a link)." The quickest way to piss off a potential or actual client is to not follow through. She hadn't e-mailed me the link. I did receive it five minutes later, but after reading the e-mail, anything would push me over the edge.

Red Flag #10
"so that you know- i always think that outside pictures are the nicest and turn out the best.  it is the inside lighting that is more difficult. but you cant control all of the elements no matter what outside (there can be shade areas, sun spots)." Sounds like a lame excuse. A real photog deals with the elements. DUH!

Conclusion
Me: Thanks for getting back to me. Unfortunately we are going to go with another photographer.



Her: Thanks for your time.That's ok. I don't think my style is what you are looking for. Good luck.

Umm...okay. If "style" translates into being an actual photog, then okay.

I  could have been mean. I could have been rude. I could have be down right nasty. But I decided to keep it sweet and short.

So why I am SO livid? Because I was actually willing to pay these people, and still would have gone with them had I not felt shut-out. I may have even nixed the videography and just gone with the photography, which was much more affordable. I just hate people who make excuses and don't try to work with you at all. If she had offered up other suggestions on working something out, I would have been more than willing, particularly since I was willing to have a second meeting. Maybe they are just greedy and would prefer a higher paid client. I hope they get what they ask for. It drives me nuts when you try to give business owners your business and they fail miserably in their approach to serve you.

When I talked to my mother, she confirmed that the semi-rude (I'm trying to be nice) e-mail could have been because she was "insulted" that I requested to see more pics. But what real photog doesn't like to brag and brag about their great work––unless they don't have any.

Again, I am not the average bear when it comes to liking photography, but I recognize what rocks and what doesn't, even if you are on a budget. And for the record, there are a good amount of photogs out there (though minus the video) that offer excellent packages that include more hours of coverage, an engagement session, and in some cases a second photog.

Brides beware. Don't get caught up in the BS just because you feel pressured to book. I am glad that I waited patiently and used common sense and gut-judgment instead of dropped $2,000 sporadically on a "wannabe."

Finding the Perfect Photog Part III: Let the Interviewing Begin!

Today I interviewed my first two photographers who were basically like night and day. I went prepared with my list of about 30 questions that I had compiled from a simple Google search "questions to ask wedding photographer and clicked on the first five links to compile a list.

The first meeting was with a couple––the husband was the videographer and the wife the photographer. They had a great photo-video package for only $1,600, which was a bit out of my original budget, but since then, I have decided that this is an area I don't want to cut corners with, especially since I am SO particular about photography and because my mother was a photographer for many years. The downside to the package was that I would have to pay for the engagement session separately, and that it only covered four hours––so if I wanted them to take pics before the ceremony, that would be extra. Also, she did not work with an assistant. The package did include two copies of digital negatives and two copies of the DVDs. While I LOVE their videos, I am NOT completely sold on the photography. While the average bride would probably be pleased with the photos (and the price!), I was not completely sold. I really like the couple because they seem down-to-earth and laid back. They are still an option but not my first.

The second meeting was with a OCD (she said so herself!) lawyer turned photographer who has WONDERFULLY crisp beautiful photos. However the wonderful photos did not overwhelm her control-freak (she also said this) aura. She chattered the ENTIRE time 1,000 miles an hour, and I don't think she fully understood the concept that I was having a SMALL wedding, so there wouldn't be a "cocktail" hour. I literally felt drained after listening to her. While I know she will be organized and on point, I don't think it will be worth dealing with her overwhelming personality. Last I checked, it was good protocol to match the speed and personality of your client, not bombard them. Just saying.

Out of the two meetings I did draw a few conclusions. First, I am considering raising my photog budget from $1,000 to $2,000, but only if FH's parents can contribute about $600 and if my mother could pitch in $500. While I am willing to raise our budget, I do feel a bit queasy about dropping so much on pics, but a super duper photog (which I have determined I do want  after all), requires some  super duper money. So this probably means we'll have to nix videography after all (bummer!), but if the package includes five or more hours of coverage, an engagement shoot, digital photos, AND a photog assistant I'm game for the bigger package, since these are all additional things I would like anyway. An added bonus would be to get at least three photo albums included, but I definitely will NOT hold my breath on that one, since good albums tend to been EXPENSIVE, at least from the photog.

For video, I am thinking about going with my original idea and just have someone run their video camera on a tripod, and that will have to suffice. I am even thinking about sacrificing my ipod music idea as well (though this is only a couple hundred dollars) and I'm even thinking of nixing a limo/driver as well if we do end up splurging on the photography. I don't want our budget to keep ballooning with less important details that aren't that major for me.

The only thing will be convincing FH that it will be worth the $2,000 on photos alone (our original plan was to hire a student photog). He won't be opposed to our parents pitching in, but he may frown a little since my mother is already contributing $1,600 for the reception, plus she's making my jewelry, AND she has to fly out here. But I have decided that we will only get married once, and besides our memories we don't have any other record to leave our children. I realize that other people spend far more on photography, but $2,000 is a pretty big deal since we wanted to keep our budget around $4,000.

So depending on what the verdict is from our parents, I will book a few more interviews with photogs that are around our new budget to see what's out there before making any final decisions.

Finding the Perfect Photog Part II: 3 Great Tips

Today I didn't end up cleaning my room like I had planned to do, or making skin moisturizer either. Instead, I spent the last seven hours combing the net for photographers.  I freaked out yesterday when I realized just how important photography is to me, and how I am will to spend a whole lot more than a measly $600 if I have to if it means getting really nice photos.

Really nice photos don't come cheap though. Many packages have a base price of $2,500 to $3,000 and sometimes that price doesn't even include digital negatives. Are they living in the same economy I am? I am thinking though of upping my budget to $1,000 to $2,000. I will try to get our parents to contribute 25% to 50% of the amount, which would be a HUGE help (we will see if this happens). Even if they don't I think I am willing to forgo taking all but one summer class, just so I use the extra money toward the photography amount. There are some places that do financing though, so I may not have to worry about that.


While searching, I made quite a few mistakes during my initial research (especially since it was so hard to find articles on the web in researching). So here is a list of tips on researching photogs (whether you are on a budget or not):

1. Devote Plenty of time to your research
Devote plenty of (frustrating) hours of finding photographers in your area. This may be easier for some areas than others. Also, the upload times on many of these sites take a long time unless you have super duper internet speed (but even then, if your service provider caps you on a certain amount you can upload each month, you may want to opt seeking out someone who have unlimited). Some great sites to start out with:

• Facebook pages & groups: while I only landed a couple of hits on here, the great part is that you can often message the photographer on the spot and see some of their work uploaded in albums, which you will be able to upload a lot faster since Facebook caps the size of their photos
  
• Flickr groups, pro & individuals: many professionals and novices have photos listed on Flickr and a contact e-mail and in some cases an actual web address that will lead you to more of their work. Just watch out for the dates when they last posted. One person I found hadn't posted for two years and likely moved, or may have not been taking pictures at all.
  
• Local photography associations:  One website I visited was specifically for photojournalists (which tends to run a bit more sometimes). The great part is that the prices were listed and there were links provided to their websites. Click here to view.
• Friends, family, co-workers, associates, peers who have had recent photography: Whether you inquire on Facebook, via e-mail, or face-to-face, find out who provided their photography. Most people are willing to share that info. Don't forget to mention who referred you and make sure you find out if they have ever done weddings. If they have not, don't risk it.
  
• Photography or photojournalism students: Look around at the local colleges, post some listings––you may find great aspiring photographers. If they have a decent portfolio and references, it could be a good steal. Just make sure, as with anyone else, get a contract in writing.
  
• Decidio: I discovered this website during a Google search: affordable photography Philadelphia and this site provided me with an entire page of results that I couldn't even get through tonight.
  
• Google: play with different search terms to see what you come up with. When you get frustrated, keep trying. I was about to give up when I discovered Decidio through a search.
• Reception & Ceremony site preferred/recommended photogs:  It is worth the inquiry to see what these photogs have to offer, especially since they have actually covered an event at your venue.
  
• Knot.com, Brides.com etc (as a last resort): While these sites offer (over-priced) options, it is a great place to start to view different photography styles just to see what you would like for your own wedding. That way it makes it much easier to sift through the pile

Don't forget to expand your search to statewide or if you have close neighboring states. If you are in a optimum location like Philadelphia, you can seek photographers in PA, NJ, and DE as prospects. Some of them have small fees to travel outside of a certain radius, which may be minimal and not offensive to your budget if they have excellent photography and packages. The only down side is that the photog may or may not be familiar with the area in getting around or with your reception/ceremony/photo shoot site.

2.  Research dates of availability and prices first before falling in love with a photographer.
I know it sounds obvious but I learned this the hard way after falling in love with a photographer's photos, e-mailing, and finding out that she was already booked. Then in other cases I would practically have drool all over the screen before I realized that the average package was $2,500 or higher. Don't let the price completely deter you though. Some are willing to sell their services a la carte, particularly if you know you just want a couple of hours of coverage and only a CD––that can cut your budget dramatically. I find that the easier way to approach the site is by skimming their photos just to make sure their style is consistent and plentiful, then looking for their availability (if they have it listed) and finally looking at their prices.



3. Have all of your info ready e-mail so you don't have to send e-mails back and forth.
So it is probably a good idea to make sure your date is set in stone as far as your venue and ceremony site (unless for some reason you want to plan everything around the photog's schedule). Include the:

• date of your event (this should be the first thing you mention, that way if they aren't available, they can stop reading)
  
• the place and address of the ceremony and/or reception (include city, state, and zip)
• what type of services and/or packages you are looking for (number of hours, 1 or 2 photogs, video, copyright, digital negatives, albums etc)
• your budget (within reason! make sure if you want something significantly less, mention that you want less coverage hours––like 2-3 hours instead of 5 etc; don't insult them!)
• questions you may have
• who/what referred you
  
• your contact info (if you want to be contacted via phone)
  

Don't write a novel but don't be too short or frank either. Be gentle and courteous. Mention a line about how you admire their work––and don't be generic, be specific.

You can also call of course, but if you want to keep a electronic paper trail of all of your research and communications, it it far easier to look for a sent e-mail and/or response than it is to sort through all of your billions of collages, outlines, notes, magazines etc.


I am so glad that I am making progress in this area sooner than later!

Finding the Perfect Photog

So last night I received a great deal in my e-mail for MJS Studios: $595 for 8 hours of photography--a great steal and financing was even available. So I put in a request to be contacted online and I told them to call me after 2 pm today. So after I got off of work I rushed home and found my cell phone (I thought I lost it) only to discovered they had already called and left a message. I was slightly annoyed, but the guy seemed nice enough so I called back to see if I could schedule an appointment.

When I called back, supposedly Tim wasn't available so I talked this other guy who had a really gruffy (and almost creepy) voice who tried to sell me the package on the spot and said the deal was expiring today (mind you that there was no expiration to the coupon they sent). It wasn't a hard sell, but it was enough to leave me disappointed, particularly since I wouldn't know what photographer I'd be working with, nor the style of the wedding until 30 to 60 days out. Plus to have all the photos on disk would be an additional $400 to $600. Plus it did not include an engagement shoot. Originally I was looking to spend $800 to $1,500 when we were going to spend $8,000, but now I am looking for a decent package under $600, especially now since our wedding and guest list has been significantly scaled back.

I kind of guessed it may have been too good to be true, but thought I'd give it a feel anyway. I did learn one important thing about selecting a photographer for us though. I definitely don't like the feel of a big corporate 800-number business taking my photographers. I want to make sure I actually like the person I am working with and can actually see their work before I ever put money down. I don't want to talk into a phone and that be the only means of communication. I want some really classy photos, but after the really nice shots, I just want to let it all hang out.

I really want engagement shoot, but I don't know yet if we can really afford it. It would be nice to have a shoot where we both get super glamorous and take old school pics. Today I had the idea that maybe we can just do our own shoot or get someone we know or do a crazy shoot where we pick places all around the city to take photos and have random people take photos for us. Random places include Chuck E. Cheese where they have awesome photo booth black and white prints, that are not high in quality but are fun and cute. Then we can go to other places like other photo booths, the LOVE sign in Philly and other spots. We'll see how the next couple of months goes as far as our budget.

Well at least I have a clear head going into it. I honestly haven't done a lot of research on photogs yet, so this is still something I need to step up the pace on, especially since it is at the top of important things to accomplish along with the dress and venue.